Are you hooked on fermented cod liver oil?
Are you hooked on fermented cod liver oil?
This popular supplement in the “real foods” community has been widely promoted as the only true “traditional” cod liver oil, the “high vitamin” cod liver oil recommended by Dr. Weston A. Price DDS, and the very secret to the superpowers of the Vikings. It’s recommended for pregnant women, babies, and children of all ages. People facing health challenges know they should take extra in the belief that something that tastes so bad must really be good.
But is it really good? Or just too good to be true? Is it truly rich in the fat-soluble vitamins A, D and K? Does it provide healthy fats in an easy-to-digest and assimilable form? Is it really cod?
Or is it possible that consumers been “hooked” on a product that’s overpriced, mislabeled and not at all what it seems?
Learn the truth now in my FREE report Hook, Line and Stinker: The Truth about Fermented Cod Liver Oil. To get your copy, click here.
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Hi dr. kaayla,
so what do you recommend in place of fermented cod liver oil?
thx,
Isabel
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Thank you for sticking your neck out to provide this valuable information!
You should be ashamed of yourself. I, and countless others, have experienced first hand the tremendous positive impact that the Green Pasture FCLO and Butter Oil have had on health – and especially teeth. The impact can be felt by many within a day, and there is no greater test than that.
Dave Wetzel of Green Pasture is an absolute hero, and has provided a tremendous wealth of information on the site regarding all his products. There is nobody more transparent; which stands in great contrast to your tenuous ‘report’ that does not even disclose the labs.
I cannot fathom what possibly drove you to write something like this. If there was truly a problem, you would not have to hide your sources.
Clearly, an important disagreement on the Board of Directors of the Weston A Price Foundation has broken out into the public domain concerning the contents, and the quality of the Green Pasture Cod Liver.
First, it should be clearly stated that that The Weston A Price Foundation has come to an important cross roads. The Weston A Price Foundation has over the years built a huge base of TRUST within and outside of it membership. This base of TRUST is so strong that I think it would be safe to say that just about any recommendation that the Weston A Price Foundation makes has immediate credibility both inside and outside it membership.
Because of this enormous base of TRUST, the WAPF has been able to attract “sponsors” that contribute large amounts of money to the WAPF in exchange for an “Official Endorsement” of these specific products by the WAPF.
If my understanding is correct, the number one level of sponsorship for the WAPF is the “GOLD SPONSOR”. That is to say, GOLD Sponsors give the most amount of money to the WAPF. And, if I understand correctly Green Pasture IS one of the FEW GOLD Sponsors. And, in exchange for the sponsorship fees paid by Green Pasture, the Weston A Price Foundation GIVES it’s HIGHEST LEVEL OF ENDORSEMENT. And, this WAPF Endorsement of Green Pasture products is strongly communicated to all of its members
This arrangement is all well and good as long as no questions of QUALITY, RELIABILITY or SAFTEY arise. BUT, the moment any such questions arise / become a part of the public domain, IMMEDIATELY THERE IS A QUESTION OF CONFLICT OF INTEREST on the part of the Weston A Price Foundation. WHY? Because the WAPF has taken money in exchange for their endorsement. THERE IS NO GETTING AROUND THIS FACT!
Anything that any member of the WAPF Board of Directors says or states concerning Green Pasture products is CLEARLY a CONFLICT OF INTEREST. And as such, a huge public relations disaster! Hundreds, if not thousands and thousands of WAPF members and their friends are now ACTIVELY questioning BOTH the credibility of the Weston A Price Foundation and their FINANCIAL PARTNER (GOLD SPONSOR), Green Pasture. This is indeed a CREDIBILITY DISASTER for an organization that is founded on credibility.
WHAT CAN YOU DO? WHAT MUST YOU DO?
1. The WAPF Board of Directors MUST, in unison, inform their members and the public that they will immediately select TWO highly reputable, independent laboratories to test the Green Pasture products in question.
2. These two test laboratories MUST obtain their product samples from out in
the market place and NOT directly from Green Pasture directly. The fact is,
an highly rated independent laboratory knows exactly how to obtain the
product test samples.
3. The WAPF MUST, at all cost , AVOID the “Coca Cola Syndrome” and
insure that the TWO test laboratories are NOT influenced in any way by
the WAPF or Green Pasture.
4. Obtain the services of a TOP Pubic Relations firm to guide you through this
situation / problem and to make SURE that the WAPF does not damage its
incredible reputation. I am sure that this would include informing your
membership and the public of exactly what you are doing and then, say no
more until the results of BOTH testing laboratories are completed.
I would make it a goal to complete this independent laboratory testing by
31 October 2015 and as such, be in a position to announce the results of the TWO independent testing laboratories at the Weston A Price Wise Traditions Conference in November 2015.
I agree!
Excellent advice, Given the emotional climate and defensive posture surrounding this issue, I don’t know if WAPF can respond in a rational, systematic manner?
I’ve used Green Pastures CLO for many years. Also, I’ve been a member of ConsumerLab (https://www.consumerlab.com/) for many years and have asked them repeatedly to test GP CLO, but they haven’t yet. Hope they do.
I am just hearing about this and am incredibly disappointed in both the company and WAPF. Now that I am aware of the situation, I will follow more closely. I was about to order FCLO from a Green Pastures distributor and found this information in time. Now the question is where to get the ingredient from a manufacturer that is researched to be reliable. If anyone knows this information, I would be grateful to hear about it. Our society is so riddled with corruption that really there is very little in the world one can be sure of. Infinitely sad and horrible comment on our society as a whole. My husband is a journalist and sees this in business all the time and finds it oppressive in its’ scope; to say nothing of depressive & depressing.
Sincerely,
Lisa Sherman
I’ve read the entire report and it is pretty devastating to realized that we’ve been lied to. I took FCLO throughout my pregnancy, while nursing and even now. We eat lots of grass fed butter and eat very healthy, but I want my family and especially my child to get the best nutrition possible. Is there a cod liver oil that you do recommend?
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I just read green pastures’ rebuttal, now about to read this to find out what all the hubbub is about.
did you tour their facility? is this first hand information? or speculation?
As a nurse and nutritionist myself I find this article bogus and attention seeking. I am not going to feed into your attention seeking and “look at me look at me” behavior. This companies research is phenomenal. Your just trying to make it difficult for family run businesses that truly care about health and wellness HOLISTICALLY health and wellness! You’ve been bought by mainstream “give me statistical data” or I’ll make it difficult for you type of behavior. Leave the company alone and stop your lible and slander. Your acting like Monsanto who beats up farmers and takes their land. Anyone who listens to you, well, truly I feel sorry for them. While in some areas your on track with your thinking and others whoa! You flew off the rails. Your a bully plain and simple. You probably truly feel like your doing a good thing but sadly can’t see in third person. Why don’t you stand back and see that while this company offered you an all expense paid trip to come out and see for yourself, of which you met them with utter silence, you at that time felt like you had already dug too deep with your bantering and name calling that you had to stick to your guns with what you’ve already said. In my neck of the woods this is called a coward. Stand up and admit your wrong (which psychology tells me you won’t based off your mannerisms in your writings).
kaaylas not wrong i tested butter capsules as well there was something not right about them….your acting like monsanto beating up on kaayla
and i know who you are.
Ex employees of David Wetzel informed me that the all expense tours for people like Sarah Pope and Sandrine Love were carefully staged so that they would see ONLY what David Wetzel wanted them to see. As an ex journalist, I was also trained to reject all expense paid tours in order to maintain objectivity. I discussed this in another blog:
http://drkaayladaniel.com/transparency-blackouts-doses-and-grand-tours-my-response-to-the-healthy-home-economist/
As for admitting my wrong, I admitted the error of repeating the WAPF partyline on Green Pasture products for many years. It would have been far easier to keep quiet. I could not in good conscience do that knowing the sickness and deaths linked to that product.
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I want to commend you for your investigative journalism about fermented cod liver oil. I suppose you will have to deal with a lot of blow-back, deflection, criticism and denial. Even science-based reliable data will not convince some people to evaluate their perspective especially if that perspective is part of a belief system.
Agreed. Be scrupulously honest and above-board, whatever the cost, and let the chips fall where they will.
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While I found the article interesting, there were a lot of questions proposed, but then no real answers were given, merely speculation. And most of the labs results as I read them seemed to support the manufacturer’s claims. I also didn’t understand why if two labs said the product was good, but one lab said it was bad, the article seemed to favor the single labs results rather than two that agreed. One point that I think was completely valid is that to consumers, cod oil should come from cod, not related fish species. By the end, the article left me unconvinced that the product was bad, but did make me question whether the fermented oil was any better than any other fish oil.
Is there a non-fermented cod liver oil brand that you recommend?
Whoa!
“Hook, Line and Stinker” is amazing. You write like shooting laser beams.
Mercola was right all along on this one.
You are gonna get it now, you naughty reporter!
Well done, congratulations. I hope people listen. No more frauds!
But remember that no good deed goes unpunished.
Thanks for your hard work, Kaayla!
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They posted a rebuttal three days ago and I’m wondering what you think.
http://www.greenpasture.org/fermented-cod-liver-oil-butter-oil-vitamin-d-vitamin-a/response-to-questions-on-fermented-cod-liver-oil/
Personally I’ve never liked or saw any benefit from the “fermented” cod liver oil. I can’t take normal cod liver oil because it makes me extremely nauseated. I thought maybe the “fermented” cod liver oil would be different. No, it makes me very nauseated. I’ve given it to my children over long periods of time and have not noticed any difference with their health.
This entire thing is so confusing.
Thanks for your investigative reporting. I have one question that I’m still confused about. WAPF did send fermented oil to be tested by Dr. Martin Grootveld. the results are posted here: http://www.westonaprice.org/wp-content/uploads/13GrootveldReport.pdf.
Dr. Grootveld found no rancidity in the fermented cod liver oil. He specifically tested for the secondary products of oxidation – aldehydes, finding none detectable. Do you have any idea why that might have been the case if the oil is rancid? Could aldehydes be somehow undetectable?
thank you again.
I may write more about Grootveld’s report in the future. All the other labs found Free Fatty Acids and Acid Values that far exceeded GOED, CRN and FAO standards and were indicative of advanced rancidity. I did not find Grootveld very credible. As I wrote in Hook, Line and Stinker.:
“An unexpected finding came from Martin Grootveld of De Montfort University in Leicester, who analyzed a sample sent by Sally Fallon Morell, President of the Weston A. Price Foundation. His tests showed an EPA to DHA ratio of 9.24 to 6:16, which is not a ratio likely to be found with cod liver oil. Whether Grootveld did not notice this or chose not to be the bearer of bad news is unknown, but his letter to Fallon Morell makes no mention of the finding. His letter also misidentifies EPA (eicosapentaenoic Acid) as a 22:5 fatty acid and DHA (docosahexaenoic Acid) as a 24:6 fatty acid. The correct nomenclature for EPA is 20:5, and for DHA 22:6. (In chemistry shorthand, two numbers separated by a colon provide the chain length and number of double bonds.)”
Hi, my comment has been stuck in moderation, so I figured I will repost it just in case it’s some sort of glitch.
Here it is:
Thanks for your investigative reporting. I have one question that I’m still confused about. WAPF did send fermented oil to be tested by Dr. Martin Grootveld. the results are posted here: http://www.westonaprice.org/wp-content/uploads/13GrootveldReport.pdf.
Dr. Grootveld found no rancidity in the fermented cod liver oil. He specifically tested for the secondary products of oxidation – aldehydes, finding none detectable. Do you have any idea why that might have been the case if the oil is rancid? Could aldehydes be somehow undetectable?
thank you again.
I will discuss Dr. Grootveld’s findings more in the future. I do not find his report very credible. As I write in my report “Hook, Line and Stinker”:
An unexpected finding came from Martin Grootveld of De Montfort University in Leicester, who analyzed a sample sent by Sally Fallon Morell, President of the
Weston A. Price Foundation. His tests showed an EPA to DHA ratio of 9.24 to 6:16, which is not a ratio likely to be found with cod liver oil. Whether Grootveld did not notice this or chose not to be the bearer of bad news is unknown, but his letter to Fallon Morell makes no mention of the finding. His letter also misidentifies EPA (eicosapentaenoic Acid) as a 22:5 fatty acid and DHA (docosahexaenoic Acid) as a 24:6 fatty acid. The correct nomenclature for EPA is 20:5, and for DHA 22:6. (In chemistry shorthand, two numbers separated by a colon provide the chain length and number of double bonds.)
Stay as far away from Green Pasture “Fermented Cod Liver Oil” as you can!! I took it for too long and it jacked my whole body up with inflammation. I stopped taking it for 1 week and a ton of the inflammation left like crazy!!
I appreciate the time and money you spent in compiling this report (cost of the products alone would have been prohibitive for most people). I am a bit concerned about your wild assumptions that the product is from China – this seems unfounded, and nothing in your report suggests it?
I’ve spent a long time reading your report, but I’ve found your data is open to interpretation, and I’ve put my own interpretation of the results here:http://www.thehealthcloud.co.uk/green-pastures-rancid-report-analysis/
I would be very interested to know what you think of this, because I can’t say that the results show that the cod liver oil rancid at all, yet you claim it does. Am I missing something here?
The only thing which really stands out to me is the lack of quinones/ vitamin K and the presence of trans-fats. This is both disappointing and worrying. I’ve contacted GP about this because I can’t understand the presence of them in the oil either.
I did not say the Green Pasture products come from China. I said pollock oil is substituted in some “cod liver oils” that come out of China.
Re rancidity, FCLO greatly exceeds GOED, CRN, FAO, EPS standards for Free Fatty Acids and Acid Value. This can only be true of an oil in an advanced state of rancidity.
Apologies – I’ll make the amendment to the response, but the way your article is written does strongly imply that you think the product is from China.
With regards to the free fatty acids in the product – yes, we all know they are present, but I am not sure why you are worried about it. When triglycerides are broken down in the gut, they become free fatty acids and glycerol, which aren’t toxic.
As much as anyone, I want to know if FCLO is toxic or not, but your report doesn’t prove it is (far from it in fact).
Perhaps the fermentation process breaks down molecules in a similar fashion to the rancidity process – this wouldn’t surprise me at all. Both require the products to be left to bio-degrade, but what I care about is the presence of toxins (which you found none) and nutrients (the content of some is questionable from your report).
If there are no toxins, then I see the presence of FFAs to be a good thing, or at least unimportant. In many products they may indicate rancidity, but don’t prove it.
The Free Fatty Acids and Acid Values far exceed GOED, CRN and FAO quality and safety standards. Most fats and oils experts consider high FFA and Acid Value to be indicative of advanced rancidity.
I’m sure that high FFA does indicate advanced rancidity, but the fact is, other rancidity values you tested for came back either inconclusive or negative, suggesting that the oil isn’t rancid. Could the FFA be a result of the fermentation process? Perhaps.
FFAs themselves are not harmful, and only indicate rancidity, they do not prove rancidity or toxicity.
I was made very ill by Green Pastures CLO. I had a bottle of the liquid form in my refrigerator for only about a month and I suffered nausea/stomach upset after ingesting it. After I stopped taking it, the symptoms went away. I didn’t have this problem with the capsules, although I would re-experience the rancid taste coming back up. I really wanted this product to work, but my body rejected it.
After ignoring FCLO for several years, your report forced me to write a commentary.
http://fermentacap.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=41&Itemid=200
If you even read the info on the GP website, you find enough contradictory or speculative information to wave a red flag vigourously enough to make me question the validity of the product.
Dr Kaayla, there has been a lot of speculation that you have ulterior motives and are trying to slander the GP name rather than investigate its integrity. I’ve even heard that you (and others) are starting an organisation to rival WAPF.
Essentially, if this is true, this whole report is subject to some serious reporting bias, which raises a whole lot more questions about it (and is also extremely unscientific). I was wondering what you thought about these accusations?
Dr. Ron appears to be starting an organization for paleo, primal and Price people. IMO, they should call it PPPP. Add Pottenger in there and you could get another P…
Sally Fallon has written articles criticizing the paleo/primal people so doesn’t really have a leg to stand on with regards to opposing an umbrella organization that includes them given she has gone out of her way to exclude them.
Second, she threw Dr. Ron out of WAPF. So… any whining about him starting his own club after throwing him out of hers sounds like sour grapes to me. Also sounds very elementary school, frankly. I can’t think of much but the Calvin and Hobbes GROSS club…
I’ve never been a member of WAPF. Too many articles are like the paleo/primal ones, nitpicking over the stuff Fallon disagrees with vs. the more than 90% they agree on. She’s done it with book reviews too, where a book is almost entirely WAPF but disagrees on a point or two and gets massively slammed in reviews.
From the outside, it has always looked to me like disagreeing with Fallon was an unforgivable sin. Given that I have my own brain and I’d not want to use hers instead, I never thought I’d be welcome at WAPF. Just the impression I had of the organization.
I use a microwave and can find no evidence this is bad if you don’t nuke plastic.
I suspect much of the benefit of raw milk is because it’s pastured rather than because it’s not pasteurized. Most of the known nutrients in pastured milk missing in commodity milk are heat-stable. I think low-heat pasteurized pastured milk is a decent alternative, particularly when speaking to someone who actually had listeria and almost lost her baby or someone with an active infection due to diverticulitis. I’m not telling these people raw is better, though we drink raw here ourselves.
I always assumed these sorts of things would disqualify me from being really welcome at WAPF.
I do not assume if I disagree with mainstream paleo, the
Paleo Mom, any of Mark’s primal stuff, or the PHD folks, I am unwelcome. I actually participate in their forums/Facebook/blogs/etc public discussions. I disagree with all of them on some points and have never felt I was threatened with excommunication for it. I’ve actually seen all of these people change their minds on some points as well over time when the research warranted it.
I’ve never claimed “membership” in any of these; I just say I’m for real food. No group has co-opted that term yet.
I *mostly* got the feeling that Fallon didn’t permit disagreement rather than any specific evidence of it, except her articles seemed to be arguing against anyone who didn’t agree 100%, which is sorta ridiculous; there’s no human being on the planet I agree with 100%.
But her booting Dr. Ron, after years and years of him being both a member and Gold sponsor of WAPF, kinda proves my feeling correct. It looks like you have to check your brain at the door and just agree or you’re anathema at WAPF.
Sorry, I’m rather attached to my brain.
As far as this being some big conspiracy amongst anti-WAPF forces, I seriously doubt it.
The fact is that Kaayla being vice-president of WAPF and co-author of a book with Fallon had to have been a big money-maker for her. WAPF has gazillions of members; their endorsement is extremely valuable. Until this, if you were a WAPFer and want to hire a nutritionist, who else would you hire?
Similarly, Dr. Ron made money not only off endorsement by WAPF but specifically selling the products in question.
I just don’t see how forming their own club when they had Fallon’s endorsement of a much bigger club could possibly have been a motivation in producing this report.
I urge everyone to read it. If you don’t understand the science well, find someone you know and trust who does and have them explain it to you.
There’s a number of issues besides the rancidity one. I mean, if you can get past leaving liver at room temperature for a year and believing this is a good thing.
There’s the question of where did the trans fats come from, given their chemical structure shows they could not have been from fish PUFAs; Dr. Enig must be rolling in her grave.
There’s the question of how they managed to get a different EPA:DHA ratio than every other fish oil out there.
And there’s the DNA test showing no cod were harmed in the making of this product.
Basically: it’s made from cheaper Pacific pollock rather than Nordic cod, “fermented” until rotten, adulterated with vegetable oils and sold as a premium product costing way more than all other CLO.
That’s the science, peoples.
Nothing WAPF or the manufacturer has said in their defense really contradicts this. Fallon has basically said it’s been good for her family, so you’re wrong. The FLCO guy says he has someone reviewing the research – not a scientist, but a lawyer. Masterjohn wrote a semantic discussion of what rancidity means without addressing the rest of the issues.
The defense has been kinda lame, IMO.
To repeat a comment/question:
Dr. Kaayla — a lot of people taking FCLO are struggling with tooth decay. I myself am researching supplements. What do you recommend in place of fermented cod liver oil?
I would enjoy plenty of fish and a variety of foods rich in Vitamins A, D and K2. Many people who were relying on FCLO are showing extremely low Vitamin D levels so you might want to have that tested. As I have offered in the last page of the Special Report, I would be happy to do a free short consult and, if it looks like testing is in order, could help you get that testing done.
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Thanks for your ebook, it’s so well documented. I haven’t made it all the way through yet, but so far, what you’re saying fits with my own experiences with Green Pasture’s FCLO. I started taking it regularly 2 or 3 years ago and I’ve seen a steep drop off in its effectiveness in combating tooth sensitivity. Recently, a bottle of FLCO went bad after I’d consumed about a third of the product. The flavor and odor soured and it developed a slight fizzy carbonation.
I thought it was somehow just me, but I should have listened to my gut telling me that this product has stopped doing me any good.
To the people asking what to take instead, I’m going to try grass fed butter oil instead (but not the Green Pasture brand). I went on a butter binge a while back, eating a lots of it daily on popcorn, toast, veggies, in gravy that was 50% butter, etc. After a few months, I had a stellar dental checkup, my dentist was really surprised. And this was just generic brand butter from Safeway. So the butter oil seems like it’s worth a shot.
I have one suggestion – maybe a condensed version of the book would be a good idea. Your book is good, but it’s long! A page of bullet points, with references to the book, would be less daunting and possibly get more people interested.
Hello Kaalya- I am new to your blog, and this comment may be a little “late”, but I have only found out about the cod liver oil scandal recently. (I read your e-book, by the way). In any case, I took the fermented cod liver oil in the Fall of 2014, for only about 1 month; I stopped because I had such bad symptoms, and realized I wasn’t feeling any better, I was actually feeling worse! I originally started taking it because I was inspired by Ramiel Nagel’s book, where he recommended this product, and of course I had already heard how “healthy” it was for years before. I thought you might be interested in the symptoms I had, so I write them below- (I recorded them at the time, so this is accurate). Of course, I can’t be 100% sure that all of the symptoms came from the cod liver oil; however, they appeared, slowly over time, during the duration of time that I took the cod liver oil, and then slowly receded once I stopped. Also, in case you’re interested, I took the gelcaps, not the liquid. Here goes:
1) Digestive distress, which eventually became extreme. I took the tablets with meals, as recommended, and it felt like the food just “stopped” in my stomach.
2) Extreme bloating- after ingesting, my stomach would balloon up, and I would have to unbutton my pants. This is a problem I normally never have, as my stomach is usually very flat.
3) Extreme post nasal drip. (As if swallowing this pill was causing inflammation somewhere in my throat or sinuses).
4) More muscle aches, as well as muscle injuries, than usual. (I am a dance teacher, so I exercise a lot, but I almost never get injuries. However, I had two big and rather painful injuries rather close together).
5) Dizziness. Mostly when going from a sitting position to a standing position, but sometimes during exercise.
6) One night a awoke from sleeping with tachycardia, which lasted about 1 hour. Granted, I’ve had this before- (I’ve had it checked by a cardiologist; he said it’s benign, and my heart is healthy). I’ve only very rarely had tachycardia, and it usually only lasted a few minutes. After the tachycardia incident, I stopped taking the cod liver oil. I have not had tachycardia since.
All the other symptoms slowly went away, and I got back to normal. I hope this is of interest to you. Thanks for your research on this subject!
Thanks so much for sharing. You are helping many people.
I was just about to buy this stuff but I will definitely be doing some more research first. In the meantime I think we will try some liver and butter. Thanks for putting this info out there, I just hope it turns out to be legit because it really stinks to not be able trust to people to tell the truth. Especially about things that can have real consequences for a lot of people’s lives.
Don’t know if it’s GP fermented CLO/butter caps or not, but I started taking 4 a day in 2 split doses. I wound up with nausea, abdominal bloating, loss of appetite. I won’t take any more and hope the symptoms will go away.
I stopped taking GP because the last bottle I used contained disgusting chunks of fish liver in it. Not just that– GP is purported to contained higher levels of vitamin D, and is often used to supplement vitamin D. However, when my blood test returned from doctor visit my vitamin D was low and I was told to take 1000 IU supplement.
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When Dr. Natasha Campbell-McBride healed her son of autism she was most likely using a genuine, high-quality cod liver oil from Norway that was privately labeled by Green Pasture. That was a good product with healing benefits, and very different from the so-called “fermented” cod liver oil that came out in 2006. The “science” she includes in her books comes straight from Sally Fallon Morell and her “expert” Dave Wetzel, the owner of Green Pasture. Sadly, Natasha has stuck with the brand despite massive evidence that it’s harming many in the GAPS and WAPF communities.
I’ve been using this oil – and all I have to say is, I do find it “tastes” rancid and that concerns me. Gut instinct after seeing this, makes me wonder.
Trust your gut, not the “gurus”!
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We used to carry fclo in our store. We quit after I called gp with some concerns about the taste and smell of the products. It’s touted as being flavorless, but mine smelled and tasted rancid, if not putrid. We’d had this with several batches, but when I talked to the owner of the company he told me that “rancid is the same as fermented.” I objected, talked about oxidation etc, and w when he continued to claim that all was well, I asked him to please just take a look at the batch in question. He refused to even check the batch to see if maybe we got a bad one, and wouldn’t check my bottles if I send them back. I asked about the process used to make it, and after he explained it I realised that rather than fermenting those livers, they were simply letting them rot a vat. He admitted a much, but reiterated that rotten, rancid, fermented, it was all the same thing. We pulled those products, and won’t be carrying them again. Thank you for confirming the reasons that we took this action, and for putting yourself in the crosshairs to make it public. We salute you.
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